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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels

OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-11-2024, 11:33 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Sam Harris had the best summation of religitard stupidity.

Quote:there is no worldview more reprehensible in its arrogance than that of a religious believer: The Creator of the Universe takes an active interest in me, approves of me, loves me, and will reward me after death; my current beliefs, drawn from scripture, will remain the best statement of the truth until the end of the world; everyone who disagrees with me will spend eternity in hell…

Fuck 'em all.

This statement shows why Sam Harris is such a fucking dumbass. Many religions, like the Judaism for example, contains no promises of afterlife either good or bad. Many religions contain no absolutely authoritative scriptures. Some religions do not punish specifically unbelief or theological disagreements, etc.

In other words, Harris project a very specific trend of post enlightenment evangelical biblical literalism unto every single religion and insult believers in general. There is little more vain, self important and ultimately foolish than a man who thinks he is smarter than most... and then that man who thinks he is so much smarter than religious believers pens down opinion pieces in defense of police profiling and torture.

Religious people aren't the same as their religion and religions are not quotes pulled out of a religious book.
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
Sure, Harris is speaking to an american audience about the religion that has most shittified their own lives. They didn't start saying that nonsense post enlightenment...though. I say this on the other board alot. There's no rule or natural law that makes religions dogshit. The abrahamics went the extra mile, and they deserve credit for that work. It's a great relief that religious people are very often not like their religions..but, ofc, from a religious point of view..that's a defect...

Back again to that odd observation that atheists and the religious themselves share, about the religious. That abrahamic religiosity strongly correlates with social or moral indecency. Now, that, is a feature.
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
You join a gang/religion your culpable

Says it all

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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-07-2024, 10:35 PM)Aliza Wrote:
(01-07-2024, 10:29 PM)Dave Armstrong Wrote: I've tried to make replies to threads started by others and nothing usually comes of it, whereas my threads are getting a lot of activity (albeit with the usual ratio of 80% sheer insults and 20% substance). So if I go your route I will be a lot more bored here because I like good discussion and dialogues and debate. Takes two. Even mordant has stated that he was getting very bored here till I came along and got some interesting threads going.

NGL, I was too.

(01-07-2024, 10:29 PM)Dave Armstrong Wrote: I have put up conciliatory posts that are perfectly sincere. One of them has five stars on it (however that is determined). The insulters keep right on relentlessly insulting. It makes no difference.

But if most folks here have no interest whatsoever in talking to a theist who is an apologist and can defend his views, why is there a sub-forum called "Atheism & Theism," which currently has 49,404 posts, second only to the political forum (134,988)? Isn't that where such discussions are sought after and encouraged? Isn't that the very purpose of it? That's where I've been, except for one thread I started about Schubert's Unfinished Symphony. If atheists are so opposed to discussions with theists, why is that sub-forum so popular? Just so they can insult us up and down with childish and inane posts, which most commenters here do with theists?

Your logic is solid here. If the atheists did not want to engage with you, they simply wouldn't. Each of them is empowered with the ability to not read a post in a subforum or from a poster they know they don't like. 

(01-07-2024, 10:29 PM)Dave Armstrong Wrote: So it's a bit difficult to understand your point. I should maybe leave Atheism & Theism and hang around the Coffee House because I'm posting too much in the very place where atheists and theists theoretically dialogue, and which is the second most popular place in here? That makes little sense to me.

Let me clarify my point: Get to know the people here. You might have more productive conversations if you get to know them personally and they can see that you respect who they are (as they are).

...said Pollyanna. Dodgy
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-08-2024, 05:17 PM)brewerb Wrote:
(01-08-2024, 03:53 PM)Dānu Wrote: I wonder what he'll write about us on his blog now?

Atheists are 99% assholes.

Yabut, will he lie about us? Consider
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-09-2024, 02:56 AM)Aliza Wrote: Uhhh... Dave is a nice guy. He doesn't believe in the same things that I believe in, but he's a nice guy. 

So he thinks Jesus was a cool guy. I think Jesus was a fucking douche who betrayed his people. -Dave and I can still find common ground on other topics and appreciate one another's viewpoints while disagreeing on this one other thing. That's just normal human behavior. That's how you're *supposed* to act with people who are different from you.


Maybe he's a nice guy. maybe.  His continuing to post after being repeatedly told that his posting was crap and why, argues against that
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 01:47 AM)Chas Wrote: ...said Pollyanna. 

I'm not sure how to take that, Chas....  Dodgy
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-09-2024, 04:18 AM)Aliza Wrote:
(01-09-2024, 03:33 AM)mordant Wrote: Yeah that's kind of how I tried to approach him, but I WAS starting to feel like his tactics were less than completely respectful and honest. And that's why your suggestion that he drop the apologist thread-spamming thing for awhile and really make the effort to get to know us as persons first.

The Schubert discussion was his attempt at that. It was still a little heavy handed debate style and could seem like he needs to frame and position himself to come out on top in every discussion, plus by then he already had everyone wary. Too little too late I guess.

A motivating factor for me taking on the project of this forum is to give people a safe landing pad if they're trying to get out of dangerous forms of religion. People in cults, or people who are being abused or held back due to unhealthy religious practices. Even people who lack a comprehensive secular education due to the limitations placed on them from their religions is absolutely terrible. 

Nominal Christians and Christians who use Christianity to heal themselves don't bother me one bit. The former drug addict who uses religion to get sober is perfectly fine in my book up until they go overboard with it. 

So I don't know the stories of the people who come here, and nor do I know that their versions they provide us are truthful. Each theist, in my mind, is someone who potentially may be in a cult, or suffering some kind of abuse even if they don't know it (yet). 

I want people (theists) to know they have a place to go if their religion turns out to be bad. Bashing these people over the head and forcing them to leave goes against my personal goal for the forum. On the other hand, the atheists who are already here shouldn't have to endure constant proselytization attempts either.

My mind is thinking of ways that we might be able to address the needs of both parties.

He clearly fit neither of those categories. Deadpan Coffee Drinker
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-10-2024, 03:44 PM)Aliza Wrote:  
* I’m not sure on the timing. 2,500 feels good, though.

Gaza. Deadpan Coffee Drinker
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 02:14 AM)Chas Wrote:
(01-10-2024, 03:44 PM)Aliza Wrote:  
* I’m not sure on the timing. 2,500 feels good, though.

Gaza. Deadpan Coffee Drinker

Or not.
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 01:59 AM)Aliza Wrote:
(01-12-2024, 01:47 AM)Chas Wrote: ...said Pollyanna. 

I'm not sure how to take that, Chas ...

It's inverse projection.  Chas' cynicism meter is pegged out.
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-11-2024, 11:48 PM)epronovost Wrote:
(01-11-2024, 11:33 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Sam Harris had the best summation of religitard stupidity.


Fuck 'em all.

This statement shows why Sam Harris is such a fucking dumbass. Many religions, like the Judaism for example, contains no promises of afterlife either good or bad. Many religions contain no absolutely authoritative scriptures. Some religions do not punish specifically unbelief or theological disagreements, etc.

In other words, Harris project a very specific trend of post enlightenment evangelical biblical literalism unto every single religion and insult believers in general. There is little more vain, self important and ultimately foolish than a man who thinks he is smarter than most... and then that man who thinks he is so much smarter than religious believers pens down opinion pieces in defense of police profiling and torture.

Religious people aren't the same as their religion and religions are not quotes pulled out of a religious book.

Note that Harris did not say all.  He was quite specific about what kind of religious belief.
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
The quote appeared in a book called "Letter to a Christian Nation" and when it comes to those fuckheads, Harris is spot on.

BTW, those fundie jews on the West Bank who steal every piece of land they can because some shitty book claims that "god" gave it to them as well as the asshole muslims who riot because of some fucking cartoons are every bit as bad as the xhristards that Harris was writing to. Fundies are fundies no matter which non-existent god they think is calling the shots.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 01:59 AM)Aliza Wrote:
(01-12-2024, 01:47 AM)Chas Wrote: ...said Pollyanna. 

I'm not sure how to take that, Chas....  Dodgy

Your outlook is rosier than the facts warrant.
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 02:18 AM)Aliza Wrote:
(01-12-2024, 02:14 AM)Chas Wrote: Gaza. Deadpan Coffee Drinker

Or not.

How not? I didn't say Hamas, I said Gaza where the vast majority of those killed were simply Palestinian.
“Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. 
Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.”
― Napoleon Bonaparte
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 01:50 AM)Chas Wrote:
(01-08-2024, 05:17 PM)brewerb Wrote: Atheists are 99% assholes.

Yabut, will he lie about us? Consider

Not that I could tell, but then I didn't read everything regarding his time here.
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental. 
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-12-2024, 02:39 AM)Chas Wrote:
(01-12-2024, 02:18 AM)Aliza Wrote: Or not.

How not? I didn't say Hamas, I said Gaza where the vast majority of those killed were simply Palestinian.

Would you be interested in exploring this topic deeper with me? Not as a debate, but just an exchange of information and a discussion about it.
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
(01-11-2024, 11:48 PM)epronovost Wrote:
(01-11-2024, 11:33 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Sam Harris had the best summation of religitard stupidity.


Fuck 'em all.

This statement shows why Sam Harris is such a fucking dumbass. Many religions, like the Judaism for example, contains no promises of afterlife either good or bad. Many religions contain no absolutely authoritative scriptures. Some religions do not punish specifically unbelief or theological disagreements, etc.

In other words, Harris project a very specific trend of post enlightenment evangelical biblical literalism unto every single religion and insult believers in general. There is little more vain, self important and ultimately foolish than a man who thinks he is smarter than most... and then that man who thinks he is so much smarter than religious believers pens down opinion pieces in defense of police profiling and torture.

Religious people aren't the same as their religion and religions are not quotes pulled out of a religious book.
I wouldn't go quite that far as it's a perfectly valid criticism of fundagelical dogma and there are threads of that in many other Christian traditions, especially "you're special to god (just like everyone else, lol)" and "hell is an actual thing so you better behave".

But I agree with your final sentence and I think his critique did overreach.
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OT Tabernacle: Eight Ancient Parallels
"Genocide" is such a loaded word.

Why don't we just call it what it is?  Mass murder of innocent civilians.

There..... doesn't that make everyone feel better?
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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