The fear of symptoms

[skyking]

Doctor SYZ posts a wall of text, TL;DR. No thanks doc.
It does go hand in foot with your pitiful argument from authority in your first post in here though. Do stay consistent.
"a Bachelor's degree in chemistry, a Master's degree in forensics, and
specialises in biological criminalistics and toxicology."

Your expert left out the all-important qualification: Did he indeed stay at a Holiday Inn that morning?
In other words, he is no more an MD than you are

[brewerb]

My paternal grandmother was all about the chiropractor.  He 'adjusted' her frequently and assured her all the cracking and popping she was hearing and the pain she had, even when trying to comb her hair, was nothing to worry about.

Yeah, it was only bone cancer and his BS kept her from real help for too long.

Same chiropractor (I refuse to call them Dr.) 'adjusted' the neck of an elderly neighbor...he went to her house every week to do whatever voodoo he do.  After the neck adjustment, she died...whatever he did killed her.  An actual doctor would have urged her to lose a hundred or so pounds.  Funny that he packed up the wife and kids after that and moved to Central America.

I went one time to a chiropractor out of curiosity due to some shoulder problems.  Essentially I got a massage, and who doesn't feel better after a massage?  Then the pressure was on that I needed to come back every week basically till I die.  It's a freakin' scam and totally irritates me that it's covered by insurance.

A non-lethal story...a former co-worker went to the chiropractor every week.  She came in one day and told me that he had 'massaged her sinuses' and she felt so much better.  Considering the amount of menthol or eucalyptus that was massaged into her sinuses it's no wonder that I could even breathe better...and it was free for me.

I prefer quackopractor.

[brewerb]

Nah, you're probably just pissy 'cause someone degraded your manly feelings and now you have to get up several times a night to piss.

I'm just having a bit of fun. Your reply's are, well, edgy at best,............. antoginistic at worst.

Is there a specific issue between you and I, or is this behavior your 'normal'?

[Vera]

I'm just having a bit of fun. Your reply's are, well, edgy at best,............. antoginistic at worst.

Is there a specific issue between you and I, or is this behavior your 'normal'?

You do realise I was poking fun at her claiming that an enlarged prostate is because someone degraded one's manly feelings (and an enlarged prostate means someone has to piss more often), right? So you were "blaming" me for this thread and I said you're being pissy.

Nothing beats a good ole joke dissection.




ETA: Oooh, I see this thread has certainly taken an... interesting direction while I was gone... am regretting I did come back to it. Guess people can starting arguing over everything around these parts...

[brewerb]

the guy was competent by any standard. You could try and paint him into whatever box you wish, but I don't know of MD's who did manipulations to relieve pinched nerves causing migraines. They would do what, exactly?

One anecdotal individual story does not make a competent chiropractor. Do you have evidence that it was actually 'pinched nerves' or 'relieved only thru manipulation'?  Is there a chance that her recovery was coincidence and not due specifically manipulation? Do you have other evidence that this specific chiro was competent?

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad your mom got better. But I see little evidence that it was specifically due to spinal manipulation. Pinched nerves can be treated thru a number of therapies, physical therapy/techniques being the first thing that comes to mind (which many chiropractors also use in addition to manipulation). PT is also often prescribed to MD's post trauma.

I'll agree that not all chiro's are quacks. But if you look at the evidence in total, quack far out ways competent.

[brewerb]

You do realise I was poking fun at her claiming that an enlarged prostate is because someone degraded one's manly feelings (and an enlarged prostate means someone has to piss more often), right? So you were "blaming" me for this thread and I said you're being pissy.

Nothing beats a good ole joke dissection.

Nope, sounded completely personal (specific reference to sex and age).

[Vera]

Nope, sounded completely personal.

So did you claiming I gave you PTSD



If you're looking for someone to take out whatever's bugging you on, days after I made that horrible personal joke, I ain't this person.


ETA: I've also no idea how old you are.

[skyking]

you'll get no argument from me. I don't go to chiros nor recommend them.
I posted a remarkable * to me* anecdotal story from my family's past, the one and only encounter with any chiro. That you all choose to discount his treatment and my mom's subsequent recovery reflects on you all.
It was as if a light switch was flipped. You really had to be there, I guess. Here is my mom, the strongest person I have ever known, reduced to hiding under the covers and calling in sick for the first time in her life. They were that bad.
One set of X-rays and a really great history and manipulation later, they were gone. Why it might make you feel better to question this outcome, I will likely never understand but I know that it is your shortcoming not mine.

Every other MD had indeed gotten the car wreck out of her history, but not one of them was looking at her spinal x-rays with a very good eye and seeing the evidence.
He asked the critical question. Everybody had asked if she hit the wheel and he pressed on, and she said no, she held on to the wheel tightly.
So, did you hit your head on the roof?
She was a tall woman and she recalled that yes indeed, she had bumped her head.
Bingo. It explained the slight compression on one side of her neck. he literally fixed her with that first manipulation.
Afterward, she never went to a chiro again and nobody in the family would either.
It is just a story fellas, albeit a remarkable one.
Leave it at that.

[brewerb]

So did you claiming I gave you PTSD



If you're looking for someone to take out whatever's bugging you on, days after I made that horrible personal joke, I ain't this person.


ETA: I've also no idea how old you are.

Sex and age reference, own it.

[airportkid]

... you'll get no argument from me. I don't go to chiros nor recommend them ... Why it might make you feel better to question this outcome, I will likely never understand but I know that it is your shortcoming not mine ...

Then what was your point?  The story as presented appeared to be an endorsement of chiropracty.  And our "shortcomings" appear to be not accepting the story as an endorsement?

It was a remarkable episode, certainly.  But you say yourself your mom never went to chiropractor again.  It strikes me the salient point is that conventional medical practice makes mistakes, lacks thoroughness, is, in a word, imperfect, while sometimes even an unschooled moron might "fix" a toaster by giving it good whack.

[brewerb]

you'll get no argument from me. I don't go to chiros nor recommend them.
I posted a remarkable * to me* anecdotal story from my family's past, the one and only encounter with any chiro. That you all choose to discount his treatment and my mom's subsequent recovery reflects on you all.
It was as if a light switch was flipped. You really had to be there, I guess. Here is my mom, the strongest person I have ever known, reduced to hiding under the covers and calling in sick for the first time in her life. They were that bad.
One set of X-rays and a really great history and manipulation later, they were gone. Why it might make you feel better to question this outcome, I will likely never understand but I know that it is your shortcoming not mine.

Every other MD had indeed gotten the car wreck out of her history, but not one of them was looking at her spinal x-rays with a very good eye and seeing the evidence.
He asked the critical question. Everybody had asked if she hit the wheel and he pressed on, and she said no, she held on to the wheel tightly.
So, did you hit your head on the roof?
She was a tall woman and she recalled that yes indeed, she had bumped her head.
Bingo. It explained the slight compression on one side of her neck. he literally fixed her with that first manipulation.
Afterward, she never went to a chiro again and nobody in the family would either.
It is just a story fellas, albeit a remarkable one.
Leave it at that.

Understood.

[brewerb]

Then what was your point?  The story as presented appeared to be an endorsement of chiropracty.  And our "shortcomings" appear to be not accepting the story as an endorsement?

It was a remarkable episode, certainly.  But you say yourself your mom never went to chiropractor again.  It strikes me the salient point is that conventional medical practice makes mistakes, lacks thoroughness, is, in a word, imperfect, while sometimes even an unschooled moron might "fix" a toaster by giving it good whack.

There will always be an 'exception to the rule'. I'm willing to leave it at that and let this one go. To many unknown details.

[skyking]

Then what was your point?  The story as presented appeared to be an endorsement of chiropracty.  And our "shortcomings" appear to be not accepting the story as an endorsement?

It was a remarkable episode, certainly.  But you say yourself your mom never went to chiropractor again.  It strikes me the salient point is that conventional medical practice makes mistakes, lacks thoroughness, is, in a word, imperfect, while sometimes even an unschooled moron might "fix" a toaster by giving it good whack.

She never went to a chiro again because her symptoms went away, and just like me I avoid doctors of any kind. When I need help I go get it, but most of us are not rushing off seeking medical intervention for every little thing.
To equate the chiro to an unschooled moron and my mom to a toaster is pretty low too. I am trying to understand your hard on here.
Medicine is a practice and she had a few MD's who tried and really did not get it done, and one who thought of this last alternative.
I have been on the receiving end of a true quack of a ortho doc. He started me on PT when I had a separated bucket handle tear of the meniscus.
That hurt, and did nothing to cure me.
Doc #2 found it right off, and did defend the quack a bit, citing swelling and the like. If the swelling needed to go down to properly diagnose it, well prescribe some anti inflammatory and wait FFS!
Doc #2 did an arthroscopic surgery and I went back to the quack with a handful of PT bills and his bill, and strongly suggested he take care if it. I never heard another word on those bills.

[Inkubus]

the guy was competent by any standard. You could try and paint him into whatever box you wish, but I don't know of MD's who did manipulations to relieve pinched nerves causing migraines. They would do what, exactly?

Refer you to a physiotherapist?

[skyking]

and they did not.

[airportkid]

To equate the chiro to an unschooled moron and my mom to a toaster is pretty low too. I am trying to understand your hard on here.

That was a not well thought through metaphor that I realized later implied things it wasn't meant to, and I apologize.

[Inkubus]

(my bold)

Prescribe muscle relaxants and highly addictive opioids.

There is a lot of quackery in chiropractic medicine, but not all chiropractors are quacks.

What do you call a chiropractor who doesn't endorse subluxation?

A Physiotherapist? Or A Bengal Lancer?

[Inkubus]

I did not know the guy myself. Of all the ones I have met, I never got a good vibe from any of them.

Aye, same with piano tuners, dodgy bastards I tell you.

[airportkid]

... Of all the ones I have met, I never got a good vibe from any of them ...

... same with piano tuners, dodgy bastards I tell you ...

Not surprising.  The whole art to piano tuning is to tune OUT the good vibe and "dodge" it just a bit.  Funny how the most wonderful sounding instrument ever invented only sounds heart breakingly wonderful when it's just precisely enough off tune. 

[Inkubus]

Doctor SYZ posts a wall of text, TL;DR. No thanks doc.
It does go hand in foot with your pitiful argument from authority in your first post in here though. Do stay consistent.
"a Bachelor's degree in chemistry, a Master's degree in forensics, and
specialises in biological criminalistics and toxicology."

Your expert left out the all-important  qualification: Did he indeed stay at a Holiday Inn that morning?
In other words, he is no more an MD than you are

TL;DR

What an odd reply. 

What part of "chiropractics" is not utter bollocks?

[SYZ]

I believe nurse practitioners and psydocs can prescribe as well.

Dentists in Australia can prescribe a limited range of medications,
as can psychiatrists. Psychologists are currently attempting to get
the same prescribing rights as psychiatrists.

[SYZ]

This site comprehensively covers the origins, development, practices, and quackery of chiropracty.

A Close Look at Chiropractic Wrongdoing by Stephen Barrett, MD, 21 March 2019.

Various forms of spinal manipulation have been noted throughout recorded history.
The “discovery” of chiropractic was announced in 1895 by Daniel David  Palmer, a
grocer, spiritualist, and “magnetic healer” who practiced in Davenport, Iowa. Palmer
believed that he had restored the hearing of a deaf janitor by “adjusting” a hump
on his spine. Even though the nerve that controls hearing is inside the skull and does
not traverse the spine, Palmer concluded that the basic cause of disease was nerve
interference caused by displaced vertebrae.