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Racial relations in 'Murica
#1

Racial relations in 'Murica
I long ago stopped considering this country to be the once great America.

Now it's just 'Murica.

This country has probably had the worst record in dealing with race relations.

I bring up this thread because I am on the final season of Star Trek: The Next Generation, a fictional representation of the future. Yet, this show presents a realized and warm connection between races, especially of those with differing skin colors.

If we can imagine it, why cannot we make it a reality? Is 'Murica doomed, as it seems that recent political climates are predicting? Is it that those who want to transform this country into their conservative dreamland will win out in the end?

How do people become so blind that they see goodness in that which bad for people? That is the penultimate question, isn't it.

I have never considered myself to be a part of humanity, simply because I understand that I have transcended their nonsense. I am not special. I know I'm not. I simply comprehend on a different level that most will never understand.
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#2

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 02:46 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: If we can imagine it, why cannot we make it a reality? Is 'Murica doomed, as it seems that recent political climates are predicting? Is it that those who want to transform this country into their conservative dreamland will win out in the end?

In-group/out-group thinking predates the human species itself, I'd bet.
Freedom isn't free.
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#3

Racial relations in 'Murica
The human psyche truly is fascinating.

There's this black girl at work who does all she can to alienate those around her. I tried being friendly with her, but to no avail. It's at the point where some people must think I dislike her because she's black. Truth be told, she's a rude bitch.

Maybe she does dislike white people. I don't know.
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#4

Racial relations in 'Murica
There is a reason that Star Trek is called "fiction."
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#5

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 02:46 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: This country has probably had the worst record in dealing with race relations.
Tutsis, Hutus.

The Former Yugoslavia.

South Africa.

Brazil.

Expand your horizons.
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#6

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 03:03 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Expand your horizons.

I've always preferred the vertical route.
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#7

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 03:03 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 02:46 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: This country has probably had the worst record in dealing with race relations.
Tutsis, Hutus.

The Former Yugoslavia.

South Africa.

Brazil.

Expand your horizons.

Hey, no fair.  We didn't have any Tutsis or Hutus to kill.

We did a damn fine job on the Indians, though!
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#8

Racial relations in 'Murica
I note that Cortez had thousands of native troops when he wiped out the Aztecs. They were more than happy to help exterminate a people who captured the neighbors so they could rip their hearts out and send the body bounce down scores of stone steps for the entertainment of the locals.

And that's charitable compared to the Apache's odd way to respecting a captured enemy. When they had the chance they would tie a captive man upside down over a small fire and see how he dealt with the pain. If he was brave they would reduce the fire to it would take longer to kill him. This allowed the captive to demonstrate his courage. If the man man cried, screaming, and moaned, they would reduce the fire anyway, just to have a few laughs at his expense.

This the noble savage of American legend.
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#9

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 03:05 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 03:03 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Expand your horizons.

I've always preferred the vertical route.

That means 'standing up sex' in Australia. :-)
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#10

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 05:59 PM)Little Lunch Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 03:05 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 03:03 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Expand your horizons.

I've always preferred the vertical route.

That means 'standing up sex' in Australia. :-)

Same as "getting close to the SOUTH POLE." Whistling
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#11

Racial relations in 'Murica
I'm not so sure that humans in general have deeper concerns about the pain we inflict on others than we do about securing our own comforts for ourselves and our own in-group.
Freedom isn't free.
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#12

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 02:46 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: .
If we can imagine it, why cannot we make it a reality? Is 'Murica doomed, as it seems that recent political climates are predicting? Is it that those who want to transform this country into their conservative dreamland will win out in the end?

It's hard to say that things have not, over the long run, been improving.  Compare today to 1800, or 1900, or 1950, or even 1980.  Slavery is outlawed, segregation is outlawed, housing discrimination and employment discrimination and racial profiling are outlawed.  The culture at large now sees these as wicked and evil things (when they admit they exist) rather than good things, and that trend is continuing despite the momentary fiasco of our political leadership.  It's true that there's still a long way to go before equality, but I think it's premature to declare the enterprise hopelessly doomed while progress is still being made.
"To surrender to ignorance and call it God has always been premature, and it remains premature today." - Isaac Asimov
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#13

Racial relations in 'Murica
Map of the world’s most and least racially tolerant countries:

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Washington Post, Data source: World Values Survey.
I'm a creationist;   I believe that man created God.
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#14

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 05:59 PM)Little Lunch Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 03:05 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 03:03 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Expand your horizons.

I've always preferred the vertical route.

That means 'standing up sex' in Australia. :-)

That's called a knee trembler around these parts.
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#15

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 04:52 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: This the noble savage of American legend.

Cause and effect. For example, the tribes annihilating Custer's units had little cause to be friends with him, seeing as he burned down their villages and hunted down their women and children. And all of this, because they tried to defend their home territory and sacred places, which stood in the way of some gold diggers and settlers.
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#16

Racial relations in 'Murica
Quote:Slavery is outlawed, segregation is outlawed, housing discrimination and employment discrimination and racial profiling are outlawed.

Yet with the exception of slavery, all of those things still exist.  So much for passing toothless laws.
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#17

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-24-2020, 03:03 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:
(12-24-2020, 02:46 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: This country has probably had the worst record in dealing with race relations.
Tutsis, Hutus.

The Former Yugoslavia.

South Africa.

Brazil.

Expand your horizons.

I'd add Israel, Russia, Turkey, France and China to the list. Germany and Canada deserve a nice little historical spot too though they both came down from their high spots to descend to a more moderate, middle ground spot in company of places like Spain, Italy or Japan.
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#18

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-28-2020, 09:49 PM)Minimalist Wrote:
Quote:Slavery is outlawed, segregation is outlawed, housing discrimination and employment discrimination and racial profiling are outlawed.

Yet with the exception of slavery, all of those things still exist.  So much for passing toothless laws.

Sorry to break it to you, but there is about 400 000 slaves/people thrown in forced labor in the US. 80% of them are women and children. Most of them work in the sex industry, in the fishing industry, in agriculture and in the garment industry. It's shockinly common for something illegal though as usual you can thank some loopholes that fragilise the system, lack of enforcement and, especially, no interest from the population to stop of the problem of enslavement of migrants.
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#19

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-29-2020, 06:36 PM)epronovost Wrote: Sorry to break it to you, but there is about 400 000 slaves/people thrown in forced labor in the US. 80% of them are women and children. Most of them work in the sex industry, in the fishing industry, in agriculture and in the garment industry. It's shockinly common for something illegal though as usual you can thank some loopholes that fragilise the system, lack of enforcement and, especially, no interest from the population to stop of the problem of enslavement of migrants.

I would add the private prison industry to the list.
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#20

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-29-2020, 06:42 PM)abaris Wrote: I would add the private prison industry to the list.

Then you would have to add a million more people to the list.
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#21

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-29-2020, 06:36 PM)epronovost Wrote:
(12-28-2020, 09:49 PM)Minimalist Wrote:
Quote:Slavery is outlawed, segregation is outlawed, housing discrimination and employment discrimination and racial profiling are outlawed.

Yet with the exception of slavery, all of those things still exist.  So much for passing toothless laws.

Sorry to break it to you, but there is about 400 000 slaves/people thrown in forced labor in the US. 80% of them are women and children. Most of them work in the sex industry, in the fishing industry, in agriculture and in the garment industry. It's shockinly common for something illegal though as usual you can thank some loopholes that fragilise the system, lack of enforcement and, especially, no interest from the population to stop of the problem of enslavement of migrants.

That's an equivocation.
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#22

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-29-2020, 07:07 PM)Dānu Wrote: That's an equivocation.

Indeed, but it's not a false equivocation.
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#23

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-29-2020, 07:24 PM)epronovost Wrote:
(12-29-2020, 07:07 PM)Dānu Wrote: That's an equivocation.

Indeed, but it's not a false equivocation.

I'm not even going to try to guess what that even means. The legal institution of slavery no longer exists. Arguing that an extra-legal form contradicts his point is invalid equivocation.

Now, please. What exactly is a "[true] equivocation?"
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#24

Racial relations in 'Murica
(12-29-2020, 07:28 PM)Dānu Wrote: I'm not even going to try to guess what that even means.  The legal institution of slavery no longer exists.  Arguing that an extra-legal form contradicts his point is invalid equivocation.

Actually the legal institution of slavery still exists in the form of prison labor as mentionned by Abaris. 

I'd also like to note that @Minimalist Minimalist was mentionning that while slavery was gone other forms of racial discriminations, just as illegal as slavery, were still commonplace. Slavery is still commonplace too despite being illegal. My mention is thus a correction on the belief that slavery is gone in the US, but other form of racial discrimination and oppression while outlawed are still occuring with a disturbing regularity. All forms of racial discrimination and oppression, while outlawed, are still occurin with a disturbin regularity. 

Quote:Now, please.  What exactly is a "[true] equivocation?"

It's what's commonly known as an equivalence.
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#25

Racial relations in 'Murica
I had to look up equivocation. :-)
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