Welcome to Atheist Discussion, a new community created by former members of The Thinking Atheist forum.

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
#1

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
https://phys.org/news/2018-12-meteor-air...-dead.html

...
A meteor that exploded in the air near the Dead Sea 3,700 years ago may have wiped out communities, killed tens of thousands of people, and provided the kernel of truth to an old Bible story. The area is in modern-day Jordan, in a 25 km wide circular plain called Middle Ghor. Most of the evidence for this event comes from archaeological evidence excavated at the Bronze Age city of Tall el-Hammam located in that area, which some scholars say is the city of Sodom from the Bible. 
...
Tall el-Hammam was a thriving city state occupying Middle Ghor. The civilization had occupied the area for over 2,500 years. The city itself held the administrative center of the kingdom, and was protected by a perimeter wall up to 30m (100 ft) thick and up to 15m (50 ft.) high, for a linear distance of over 2.5km. The wall held multiple gates, towers, and likely other defensive features. But all that was obliterated when the meteor pierced the atmosphere and exploded over the area.
...

An old story, but interesting.
And my little boy named my truck "Giddyup gah gah gah!"  Isn't he cute?  He's only eight.



The following 3 users Like Cheerful Charlie's post:
  • Little Lunch, brewerb, GenesisNemesis
Reply
#2

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
Did they find a pillar of salt as well?
The following 3 users Like Little Lunch's post:
  • Bcat, GenesisNemesis, Kim
Reply
#3

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
Quote:Steven Collins (born September 11, 1950) is an American archaeologist and a professor with the College of Archaeology at the unaccredited Trinity Southwest University in Albuquerque, New Mexico, an institution that states that biblical scripture is the "divinely inspired representation of reality given by God to humankind, speaking with absolute authority in all matters upon which it touches".[1] Collins is also the Professor of Archaeology and Biblical History along with Professor of Biblical and Theological Studies at Veritas International University,[2] which is accredited by the Transnational Association of Christian Colleges and Schools which requires all accredited schools to have a statement of faith that affirms "the inerrancy and historicity of the Bible" and "the divine work of non-evolutionary creation including persons in God's image".[3] He has been an archaeologist for 30 years, researching and teaching on Near Eastern archaeology and biblical studies.


I couldnd't even find a Wiki page for Silvia but there is this....

Quote:Trinity Southwest University (TSU) is an unaccredited Christian institution of higher education with a campus in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Principally a theological school that encompasses both the Bible college and theological seminary concepts of Christian education, it offers on-campus and distance education programs and degrees in Biblical Studies, Theological Studies, Archaeology & Biblical History, Biblical Counseling, Biblical Representational Research, and University Studies.

So what we have here are two jesus freaks trying desperately to do CPR on a mummy!

I don't know about a pillar of salt but I bet they left a pile of bullshit.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
The following 6 users Like Minimalist's post:
  • Thumpalumpacus, Fireball, mordant, Kim, Szuchow, Old Man Marsh
Reply
#4

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
The "story" is *placed* in the text to be an example of the antithesis (in-hospitality) to the story of the "hospitality" of Abraham to strangers, in the prior chapter.
It's a myth. There was no Abraham, and there probably was no Sodom and Gomorrah. There may have been ... but it's not what the story is about.
It's a literary device they used to make their point. Trying to make it into a literal happening, is an example of the ignorance of American Fundamentalists, who miss the entire point of the literary work.

What there was, (and is) if you've ever been to that shore of the Dead Sea, are sulphur deposits which stink a lot, in the region.
They can explode and catch fire, and do. They "rain down fire and brimstone". And they leave "pillars" that sometimes resemble other things.
https://www.georgiagulfsulfur.com/safety...20violence.

If it was a meteor, ... a single event may not be "remembered" culturally when they came to textualizing what their culture chose to "remember" when they wrote it down, a millenium later.
The following 4 users Like Bucky Ball's post:
  • Bcat, Gawdzilla Sama, mordant, Kim
Reply
#5

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
Even turds sometimes have kernels in them. That doesn't make them ears of corn.
Freedom isn't free.
The following 3 users Like Thumpalumpacus's post:
  • Bcat, Fireball, mordant
Reply
#6

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 09:33 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote: The "story" is *placed* in the text to be an example of the antithesis (in-hospitality) to the story of the "hospitality" of Abraham to strangers, in the prior chapter.
It's a myth. There was no Abraham, and there probably was no Sodom and Gomorrah. There may have been ... but it's not what the story is about.
It's a literary device they used to make their point. Trying to make it into a literal happening, is an example of the ignorance of American Fundamentalists, who miss the entire point of the literary work.

What there was, (and is) if you've ever been to that shore of the Dead Sea, are sulphur deposits which stink a lot, in the region.
They can explode and catch fire, and do. They "rain down fire and brimstone". And they leave "pillars" that sometimes resemble other things.
https://www.georgiagulfsulfur.com/safety...20violence.

If it was a meteor, ... a single event may not be "remembered" culturally when they came to textualizing what their culture chose to "remember" when they wrote it down, a millenium later.

While the event may not have been remembered by eye witnesses, the devastation left by this event would have been obvious to one and all who ventured near the area.  500 square miles were uninhabitable for at least 700 years.
And my little boy named my truck "Giddyup gah gah gah!"  Isn't he cute?  He's only eight.



The following 1 user Likes Cheerful Charlie's post:
  • Kim
Reply
#7

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 09:55 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 09:33 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote: The "story" is *placed* in the text to be an example of the antithesis (in-hospitality) to the story of the "hospitality" of Abraham to strangers, in the prior chapter.
It's a myth. There was no Abraham, and there probably was no Sodom and Gomorrah. There may have been ... but it's not what the story is about.
It's a literary device they used to make their point. Trying to make it into a literal happening, is an example of the ignorance of American Fundamentalists, who miss the entire point of the literary work.

What there was, (and is) if you've ever been to that shore of the Dead Sea, are sulphur deposits which stink a lot, in the region.
They can explode and catch fire, and do. They "rain down fire and brimstone". And they leave "pillars" that sometimes resemble other things.
https://www.georgiagulfsulfur.com/safety...20violence.

If it was a meteor, ... a single event may not be "remembered" culturally when they came to textualizing what their culture chose to "remember" when they wrote it down, a millenium later.

While the event may not have been remembered by eye witnesses, the devastation left by this event would have been obvious to one and all who ventured near the area.  500 square miles were uninhabitable for at least 700 years.

That's not what the story says. One city was burned, .... in the story. Not a region, and it does not say anything about a large area being uninhabitable, in the general region where comings and goings are described both before and after the event. 
It was a desert. Being uninhabitale is nothing special.
The following 1 user Likes Bucky Ball's post:
  • Kim
Reply
#8

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
From the article cited.
...
The shock wave wiped out all settlements in the area and destroyed an area of 500 sq. km. And the area remained uninhabited for a remarkable 700 years after the event. Several lines of evidence support the likelihood of this event.
...
The final piece of evidence concerns what happened to the Tall el-Hammam area after the destruction. This region is considered the best-watered agricultural area in the region, yet after the Tall el-Hammam city-state was destroyed, the area remained unoccupied for about 700 years.
...
Tall el-Hammam was a thriving city state occupying Middle Ghor. The civilization had occupied the area for over 2,500 years. The city itself held the administrative center of the kingdom, and was protected by a perimeter wall up to 30m (100 ft) thick and up to 15m (50 ft.) high, for a linear distance of over 2.5km. The wall held multiple gates, towers, and likely other defensive features. But all that was obliterated when the meteor pierced the atmosphere and exploded over the area.
...

This was a major city of it's time. Travellers of that time to this city who arrived only to find utter destruction of this scale would have left tales of this that lasted long afterwards.
And my little boy named my truck "Giddyup gah gah gah!"  Isn't he cute?  He's only eight.



The following 1 user Likes Cheerful Charlie's post:
  • Kim
Reply
#9

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
Lot looks like a real scumbag for offering his daughters to be raped.

But of course women didn't count for shit which seems to be another subtext of this bible bullshit story.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
Reply
#10

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 10:39 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Lot looks like a real scumbag for offering his daughters to be raped.

But of course women didn't count for shit which seems to be another subtext of this bible bullshit story.

Didn't they get daddy drunk shortly after and hump his brains out? He may have known the proclivities of his daughters better than people understand.
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental. 
Reply
#11

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
That daughter sounds like a real Jezebel.
Reply
#12

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 10:46 PM)brewerb Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 10:39 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Lot looks like a real scumbag for offering his daughters to be raped.

But of course women didn't count for shit which seems to be another subtext of this bible bullshit story.

Didn't they get daddy drunk shortly after and hump his brains out? He may have known the proclivities of his daughters better than people understand.

Israel Finkelstein, a real archeologist unlike the two shits cited in this "study," has a fascinating take on that story.  I'll have to see if I can find it for you.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
The following 2 users Like Minimalist's post:
  • brewerb, Kim
Reply
#13

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 10:38 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote: From the article cited.
...
The shock wave wiped out all settlements in the area and destroyed an area of 500 sq. km. And the area remained uninhabited for a remarkable 700 years after the event. Several lines of evidence support the likelihood of this event.
...
The final piece of evidence concerns what happened to the Tall el-Hammam area after the destruction. This region is considered the best-watered agricultural area in the region, yet after the Tall el-Hammam city-state was destroyed, the area remained unoccupied for about 700 years.
...
Tall el-Hammam was a thriving city state occupying Middle Ghor. The civilization had occupied the area for over 2,500 years. The city itself held the administrative center of the kingdom, and was protected by a perimeter wall up to 30m (100 ft) thick and up to 15m (50 ft.) high, for a linear distance of over 2.5km. The wall held multiple gates, towers, and likely other defensive features. But all that was obliterated when the meteor pierced the atmosphere and exploded over the area.
...

This was a major city of it's time.  Travellers of that time  to this city who arrived only to find utter destruction of this scale would have left tales of this that lasted long afterwards.

OK then. 
I must have missed the part where the Bible talked about the 700 years of no occupation, or anyone else for that matter. 
The "article cited" is by a bunch of Fundy religious nuts who *need* their mythology to be literally true.
The following 1 user Likes Bucky Ball's post:
  • Kim
Reply
#14

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 11:37 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote: OK then. 
I must have missed the part where the Bible talked about the 700 years of no occupation, or anyone else for that matter. 
The "article cited" is by a bunch of Fundy religious nuts who *need* their mythology to be literally true.

Wait, are you trying to say the Bible is not historically detailed?
Freedom isn't free.
The following 1 user Likes Thumpalumpacus's post:
  • Kim
Reply
#15

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
If that's what the data says, fine -- and now it's time for a confirmatory (or otherwise) study. Certainly a meteor airburst isn't implausible -- Chelyabinsk comes to mind.

Of course, it has no bearing on whether or not the biblical stories are literally true. That's like saying the Harry Potter books talk about London, London is a real place, therefore the Harry Potter world is true.
"Aliens?  Us?  Is this one of your Earth jokes?"  -- Kro-Bar, The Lost Skeleton of Cadavra
The following 1 user Likes trdsf's post:
  • Thumpalumpacus
Reply
#16

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 11:37 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 10:38 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote: From the article cited.
...
The shock wave wiped out all settlements in the area and destroyed an area of 500 sq. km. And the area remained uninhabited for a remarkable 700 years after the event. Several lines of evidence support the likelihood of this event.
...
The final piece of evidence concerns what happened to the Tall el-Hammam area after the destruction. This region is considered the best-watered agricultural area in the region, yet after the Tall el-Hammam city-state was destroyed, the area remained unoccupied for about 700 years.
...
Tall el-Hammam was a thriving city state occupying Middle Ghor. The civilization had occupied the area for over 2,500 years. The city itself held the administrative center of the kingdom, and was protected by a perimeter wall up to 30m (100 ft) thick and up to 15m (50 ft.) high, for a linear distance of over 2.5km. The wall held multiple gates, towers, and likely other defensive features. But all that was obliterated when the meteor pierced the atmosphere and exploded over the area.
...

This was a major city of it's time.  Travellers of that time  to this city who arrived only to find utter destruction of this scale would have left tales of this that lasted long afterwards.

OK then. 
I must have missed the part where the Bible talked about the 700 years of no occupation, or anyone else for that matter. 
The "article cited" is by a bunch of Fundy religious nuts who *need* their mythology to be literally true.

The Bible is filled with tall tales and nonsense.  No Noah's flood, no Tower of Babel, no genocidal entry into Canaan by Joshua and on and on.  Of course the Oriental tall taller of Oriental tall tales of the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah didn't match what happened in history.  We don't even know if that tall tale was even original with the teller of biblical tall tales.  we do know that something truly destructive happened.
And my little boy named my truck "Giddyup gah gah gah!"  Isn't he cute?  He's only eight.



Reply
#17

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-14-2020, 12:25 AM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 11:37 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 10:38 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote: From the article cited.
...
The shock wave wiped out all settlements in the area and destroyed an area of 500 sq. km. And the area remained uninhabited for a remarkable 700 years after the event. Several lines of evidence support the likelihood of this event.
...
The final piece of evidence concerns what happened to the Tall el-Hammam area after the destruction. This region is considered the best-watered agricultural area in the region, yet after the Tall el-Hammam city-state was destroyed, the area remained unoccupied for about 700 years.
...
Tall el-Hammam was a thriving city state occupying Middle Ghor. The civilization had occupied the area for over 2,500 years. The city itself held the administrative center of the kingdom, and was protected by a perimeter wall up to 30m (100 ft) thick and up to 15m (50 ft.) high, for a linear distance of over 2.5km. The wall held multiple gates, towers, and likely other defensive features. But all that was obliterated when the meteor pierced the atmosphere and exploded over the area.
...

This was a major city of it's time.  Travellers of that time  to this city who arrived only to find utter destruction of this scale would have left tales of this that lasted long afterwards.

OK then. 
I must have missed the part where the Bible talked about the 700 years of no occupation, or anyone else for that matter. 
The "article cited" is by a bunch of Fundy religious nuts who *need* their mythology to be literally true.

The Bible is filled with tall tales and nonsense.  No Noah's flood, no Tower of Babel, no genocidal entry into Canaan by Joshua and on and on.  Of course the Oriental tall taller of Oriental tall tales of the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah didn't match what happened in history.  We don't even know if that tall tale was even original with the teller of biblical tall tales.  we do know that something truly destructive happened.

It's no more "nonsense" than any other ancient culture's literature. 
Do you call the Greek myths "nonsense" ? 
You really should learn to approach it independently from the false views of those who used it for their own purposes.

https://www.haaretz.com/archaeology/sodo...-1.5313534
Reply
#18

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
As @trdsf pointed out above, whether some destruction was rained upon some Middle Eastern town some twenty-five centuries ago, or not, does not have any significance regarding the veracity of the Bible.

That men build myths around big events is not news.
Freedom isn't free.
The following 1 user Likes Thumpalumpacus's post:
  • Gwaithmir
Reply
#19

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 11:36 PM)Minimalist Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 10:46 PM)brewerb Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 10:39 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Lot looks like a real scumbag for offering his daughters to be raped.

But of course women didn't count for shit which seems to be another subtext of this bible bullshit story.

Didn't they get daddy drunk shortly after and hump his brains out? He may have known the proclivities of his daughters better than people understand.

Israel Finkelstein, a real archeologist unlike the two shits cited in this "study," has a fascinating take on that story.  I'll have to see if I can find it for you.

I don't want the story, I want the daughters.

Or the modern day equivalent, .............

with pictures ...........

and police reports..........

and recent test results ...........

to include a mental status exam.  

Maybe I don't want them after all.  hobo
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental. 
The following 2 users Like brewerb's post:
  • Aliza, Old Man Marsh
Reply
#20

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
Well here's the story anyway.  Do note that it has fuckall to do with the Middle Bronze Age....when there were no "jews."

This is late Iron Age propaganda, as professor Finkelstein makes clear.


[Image: 41saga3.png]
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
The following 1 user Likes Minimalist's post:
  • Dānu
Reply
#21

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
Where are the Dead Kennedys when you need them?

Freedom isn't free.
The following 2 users Like Thumpalumpacus's post:
  • trdsf, Fireball
Reply
#22

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-13-2020, 09:02 PM)Minimalist Wrote: So what we have here are two jesus freaks trying desperately to do CPR on a mummy!

I don't know about a pillar of salt but I bet they left a pile of bullshit.

I find that totally stunning because phys.org is a site that I would have naturally just taken them at their word. My expectation is that they vet these things. This Trinity Southwestern University doesn't even try to pretend that they're accredited and that's totally disgusting. Biola University at least tries. Facepalm
Person     Woman     Man     Camera     TV!         Trophy
The following 1 user Likes Aliza's post:
  • skyking
Reply
#23

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-14-2020, 04:28 AM)Aliza Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 09:02 PM)Minimalist Wrote: So what we have here are two jesus freaks trying desperately to do CPR on a mummy!

I don't know about a pillar of salt but I bet they left a pile of bullshit.

I find that totally stunning because phys.org is a site that I would have naturally just taken them at their word. My expectation is that they vet these things. This Trinity Southwestern University doesn't even try to pretend that they're accredited and that's totally disgusting. Biola University at least tries. Facepalm

phys.org did also specifically use the phrase "Christian mythology" (emphasis mine) in discussing these findings.  I mean, if the data stands, then the data stands.  An airburst meteor over an Iron Age city is pretty much about as non-divine a case of proto-urban destruction as you can ask for.  No matter how hard they try, they can't make the link saying their god threw the meteor.
"Aliens?  Us?  Is this one of your Earth jokes?"  -- Kro-Bar, The Lost Skeleton of Cadavra
Reply
#24

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
(09-14-2020, 01:29 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:
(09-14-2020, 12:25 AM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:
(09-13-2020, 11:37 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote: OK then. 
I must have missed the part where the Bible talked about the 700 years of no occupation, or anyone else for that matter. 
The "article cited" is by a bunch of Fundy religious nuts who *need* their mythology to be literally true.

The Bible is filled with tall tales and nonsense.  No Noah's flood, no Tower of Babel, no genocidal entry into Canaan by Joshua and on and on.  Of course the Oriental tall taller of Oriental tall tales of the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah didn't match what happened in history.  We don't even know if that tall tale was even original with the teller of biblical tall tales.  we do know that something truly destructive happened.

It's no more "nonsense" than any other ancient culture's literature. 
Do you call the Greek myths "nonsense" ? 
You really should learn to approach it independently from the false views of those who used it for their own purposes.

https://www.haaretz.com/archaeology/sodo...-1.5313534

Greek myths nonsense?  Yes.  Nonsense.  Does anybody take any of them as true any more?  The Odessy might be a rip snorting tall tale that works as a Harry Harryhauser stop motion action movie script, but it is still Nonsense.  The adventure of Hercules as related to us is utter nonsense.  Myth and legends.  Herculese, the basis of many a B-movie script.  But Nonsense.  Plato and Heraclitus, among others had rightful disdain for these puerile little collections of nonseense.  Zeus delighted in rapes.  A Universe populated by nymphs, dryads, satyrs and other critters that populated the world.  Nonsense on stilts.  Bellerlphon killing monsters, Perseus and his magic winged horse.  Killing Medusa, fun for the whole family, but still nonsense. (Used to be my favorite Harryhausen action scene as a kid). Fun stuff for some, if we are being demanded by idiots TV preachers top believe it all, lock, stock and barrel.  All nonsense.  Like Joseph Smiths Mormonism, Elron Hubbard's "space opera" Scientology weirdness.

Nonsense.  Nonsense!  NONSENSSSSSSSSSE!  People love nonsense.  Prosperity preachers and cat eared anime girls and deeply stupid super hero block buster movies.
And my little boy named my truck "Giddyup gah gah gah!"  Isn't he cute?  He's only eight.



Reply
#25

Biblical Sodom Was Destroyed By Meteor Astronomers Say
God struck Sodom with a meteor! Deadpan Coffee Drinker
R.I.P. Hannes
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)