03-23-2020, 01:36 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-23-2020, 01:38 PM by Cheerful Charlie.)
Islam And Our Lack Of Free Will
Islam And Our Lack Of Free Will
Long ago, I went through the Quran and collected the verses that tell us we have no free will, that Allah has decided whom to lead and whom to lead astray, et al. In a debate with Link, we have some variance of opinion about this issue. It is in the end, about the problem of Allah, who is supposedly merciful and compassionate, as each sura starts out proclaiming, our lack of free will at Allah's pleasure and the problem of the existence of moral evil.
The source of all of this problem is in the Quran. And then the theologians dance begins to try to make this seem not to be the problem it is. It is a bit of a long read, but that is sometimes necessary to pound the point home when debating those who do not want to admit this is all a problem.
--------
Quran - Predestination - proof texts - list
---------------------------------------------
The Project Gutenberg EBook of Three Translations of The Koran
(Al-Qur'an)
side by side
www.gutenberg.net
Title: Three Translations of The Koran (Al-Qur'an) side by side
Translator: Abdullah Yusuf Ali - Y
Translator: Marmaduke Pickthall - P
Translator: Mohammad Habib Shakir - S
Release Date: October 27, 2Sura 5 [EBook #16955]
Language: English
---------------------------------------------------------
Translator: Abdullah Yusuf Ali - (all)
1.
Sura 2.253 - AL-BAQARA (THE COW)
Those messengers We endowed with gifts, some above others: To
one of them Allah spoke; others He raised to degrees (of
honour); to Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and
strengthened him with the holy spirit. If Allah had so willed,
succeeding generations would not have fought among each other,
after clear (Signs) had come to them, but they (chose) to
wrangle, some believing and others rejecting. If Allah had so
willed, they would not have fought each other; but Allah
Fulfilleth His plan.
---------
2.
Sura 6.035 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
If their spurning is hard on thy mind, yet if thou wert able to
seek a tunnel in the ground or a ladder to the skies and bring
them a sign,- (what good?). If it were Allah's will, He could
gather them together unto true guidance: so be not thou amongst
those who are swayed by ignorance (and impatience)!
---
3.
Sura 6.107 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
If it had been Allah's plan, they would not have taken false
gods: but We made thee not one to watch over their doings, nor
art thou set over them to dispose of their affairs.
---
4.
Sura 6.125 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
Those whom Allah (in His plan) willeth to guide,- He openeth
their breast to Islam; those whom He willeth to leave straying,-
He maketh their breast close and constricted, as if they had to
climb up to the skies: thus doth Allah (heap) the penalty on
those who refuse to believe. He who obeys the Messenger, obeys
Allah: But if any turn away, We have not sent thee to watch over
their (evil deeds).
---
4.
Sura 6.137 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
Even so, in the eyes of most of the pagans, their "partners"
made alluring the slaughter of their children, in order to lead
them to their own destruction, and cause confusion in their
religion. If Allah had willed, they would not have done so: But
leave alone them and their inventions.
---
5.
Sura 6.149 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
Say: "With Allah is the argument that reaches home: if it had
been His will, He could indeed have guided you all."
---
6.
Sura 7.177 - AL-ARAF (THE HEIGHTS)
Evil as an example are people who reject Our signs and wrong
their own souls.
Sura 7.178 - AL-ARAF (THE HEIGHTS)
Whom Allah doth guide,- he is on the right path: whom He rejects
from His guidance,- such are the persons who perish.
Sura 7.179 - AL-ARAF (THE HEIGHTS)
Many are the jinns and men we have made for Hell: They have
hearts wherewith they understand not, eyes wherewith they see
not, and ears wherewith they hear not. They are like cattle,-
nay more misguided: for they are heedless (of warning).
---
7.
Sura 9.051 - AL-TAWBA (REPENTANCE, DISPENSATION)
Say: "Nothing will happen to us except what Allah has decreed
for us: He is our protector": and on Allah let the Believers put
their trust.
---
8.
Sura 10.025 - YUNUS (JONAH)
But Allah doth call to the Home of Peace: He doth guide whom He
pleaseth to a way that is straight.
---
9.
Sura 10.099 - YUNUS (JONAH)
If it had been thy Lord's will, they would all have believed,-
all who are on earth! wilt thou then compel mankind, against
their will, to believe!
Sura 10.100 - YUNUS (JONAH)
No soul can believe, except by the will of Allah, and He will
place doubt (or obscurity) on those who will not understand.
---
10.
Sura 11.034 - HUD (HUD)
"Of no profit will be my counsel to you, much as I desire to
give you (good) counsel, if it be that Allah willeth to leave
you astray: He is your Lord! and to Him will ye return!"
11.
Sura 11.118 - HUD (HUD)
If thy Lord had so willed, He could have made mankind one
people: but they will not cease to dispute.
Sura 11.119 - HUD (HUD)
Except those on whom thy Lord hath bestowed His Mercy: and
for this did He create them: and the Word of thy Lord shall be
fulfilled: "I will fill Hell with jinns and men all together."
---
12.
Sura 13.026 - AL-RAD (THE THUNDER)
Allah doth enlarge, or grant by (strict) measure, the sustenance
(which He giveth) to whomso He pleaseth. (The wordly) rejoice in
the life of this world: But the life of this world is but little
comfort in the Hereafter.
Sura 13.027 - AL-RAD (THE THUNDER)
The Unbelievers say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from
his Lord?" Say: "Truly Allah leaveth, to stray, whom He will;
But He guideth to Himself those who turn to Him in penitence,-"
---
13.
Sura 13.039 - AL-RAD (THE THUNDER)
Allah doth blot out or confirm what He pleaseth: with Him is the
Mother of the Book.
---
14.
Sura 14.004 - IBRAHIM (ABRAHAM)
We sent not a messenger except (to teach) in the language of
his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now
Allah leaves straying those whom He pleases and guides whom He
pleases: and He is Exalted in power, full of Wisdom.
---
15.
Sura 14.027 - IBRAHIM (ABRAHAM)
Allah will establish in strength those who believe, with the
word that stands firm, in this world and in the Hereafter; but
Allah will leave, to stray, those who do wrong: Allah doeth what
He willeth.
---
16.
Sura 16.093 - AN-NAHL (THE BEE)
If Allah so willed, He could make you all one people: But He
leaves straying whom He pleases, and He guides whom He pleases:
but ye shall certainly be called to account for all your
actions.
---
17.
Sura 020.050 - TA-HA (TA-HA)
Y:
He said: "Our Lord is He Who gave to each
(created) thing its form and nature, and further, gave (it)
guidance." P: He said: Our Lord is He Who gave unto everything
its nature, then guided it aright.
---
18.
Sura 32.013 - AS-SAJDA (THE PROSTRATION, WORSHIP, ADORATION)
If We had so willed, We could certainly have brought every soul
its true guidance: but the Word from Me will come true, "I will
fill Hell with jinns and men all together."
---
19.
Sura 35.008 - FATIR (THE ANGELS, ORIGINATOR)
Is he, then, to whom the evil of his conduct is made alluring,
so that he looks upon it as good, (equal to one who is rightly
guided)? For Allah leaves to stray whom He wills, and guides
whom He wills. So let not thy soul go out in (vainly) sighing
after them: for Allah knows well all that they do!
---
20.
Sura 39.023 - AZ-ZUMAR (THE TROOPS, THRONGS)
Allah has revealed (from time to time) the most beautiful
Message in the form of a Book, consistent with itself, (yet)
repeating (its teaching in various aspects): the skins of those
who fear their Lord tremble thereat; then their skins and their
hearts do soften to the celebration of Allah's praises. Such is
the guidance of Allah: He guides therewith whom He pleases, but
such as Allah leaves to stray, can have none to guide.
---
21.
Sura 39.037 - AZ-ZUMAR (THE TROOPS, THRONGS)
And such as Allah doth guide there can be none to lead astray.
Is not Allah Exalted in Power, (Able to enforce His Will), Lord
of Retribution?
---
22.
Sura 42.044 - ASH-SHURA (COUNCIL, CONSULTATION)
For any whom Allah leaves astray, there is no protector
thereafter. And thou wilt see the Wrong-doers, when in sight of
the Penalty, Say: "Is there any way (to effect) a return?"
---
23.
Sura 42.046 - ASH-SHURA (COUNCIL, CONSULTATION)
And no protectors have they to help them, other than Allah. And
for any whom Allah leaves to stray, there is no way (to the
Goal).
---
24.
Sura 57.022 - AL-HADID (THE IRON)
No misfortune can happen on earth or in your souls but is
recorded in a decree before We bring it into existence: That is
truly easy for Allah:
---
25.
Sura 74.031 - AL-MUDDATHTHIR (THE CLOAKED ONE, THE MAN WEARING A
CLOAK)
And We have set none but angels as Guardians of the Fire; and We
have fixed their number only as a trial for Unbelievers,- in
order that the People of the Book may arrive at certainty, and
the Believers may increase in Faith,- and that no doubts may be
left for the People of the Book and the Believers, and that
those in whose hearts is a disease and the Unbelievers may say,
"What symbol doth Allah intend by this?" Thus doth Allah leave
to stray whom He pleaseth, and guide whom He pleaseth: and none
can know the forces of thy Lord, except He and this is no other
than a warning to mankind.
----
26.
Sura 074.054 - AL-MUDDATHTHIR (THE CLOAKED ONE, THE MAN WEARING
A CLOAK)
Nay, this surely is an admonition:
074.055
Let any who will, keep it in remembrance!
074.056
But none will keep it in remembrance except as Allah wills: He
is the Lord of Righteousness, and the Lord of Forgiveness.
---
27.
Sura 76.029 - AL-MULK (THE SOVEREIGNTY, CONTROL)
This is an admonition: Whosoever will, let him take a (straight)
Path to his Lord.
Sura 76.030
But ye will not, except as Allah wills; for Allah is full of
Knowledge and Wisdom.
Sura 76.031
He will admit to His Mercy whom He will; But the
wrong-doers,- for them has He prepared a grievous Penalty.
----
28.
Sura 81.028-9 - AT-TAKWIR (THE OVERTHROWING)
(With profit) to whoever among you wills to go straight:
But ye shall not will except as Allah wills,- the Cherisher of
the Worlds.
---
The source of all of this problem is in the Quran. And then the theologians dance begins to try to make this seem not to be the problem it is. It is a bit of a long read, but that is sometimes necessary to pound the point home when debating those who do not want to admit this is all a problem.
--------
Quran - Predestination - proof texts - list
---------------------------------------------
The Project Gutenberg EBook of Three Translations of The Koran
(Al-Qur'an)
side by side
www.gutenberg.net
Title: Three Translations of The Koran (Al-Qur'an) side by side
Translator: Abdullah Yusuf Ali - Y
Translator: Marmaduke Pickthall - P
Translator: Mohammad Habib Shakir - S
Release Date: October 27, 2Sura 5 [EBook #16955]
Language: English
---------------------------------------------------------
Translator: Abdullah Yusuf Ali - (all)
1.
Sura 2.253 - AL-BAQARA (THE COW)
Those messengers We endowed with gifts, some above others: To
one of them Allah spoke; others He raised to degrees (of
honour); to Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and
strengthened him with the holy spirit. If Allah had so willed,
succeeding generations would not have fought among each other,
after clear (Signs) had come to them, but they (chose) to
wrangle, some believing and others rejecting. If Allah had so
willed, they would not have fought each other; but Allah
Fulfilleth His plan.
---------
2.
Sura 6.035 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
If their spurning is hard on thy mind, yet if thou wert able to
seek a tunnel in the ground or a ladder to the skies and bring
them a sign,- (what good?). If it were Allah's will, He could
gather them together unto true guidance: so be not thou amongst
those who are swayed by ignorance (and impatience)!
---
3.
Sura 6.107 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
If it had been Allah's plan, they would not have taken false
gods: but We made thee not one to watch over their doings, nor
art thou set over them to dispose of their affairs.
---
4.
Sura 6.125 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
Those whom Allah (in His plan) willeth to guide,- He openeth
their breast to Islam; those whom He willeth to leave straying,-
He maketh their breast close and constricted, as if they had to
climb up to the skies: thus doth Allah (heap) the penalty on
those who refuse to believe. He who obeys the Messenger, obeys
Allah: But if any turn away, We have not sent thee to watch over
their (evil deeds).
---
4.
Sura 6.137 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
Even so, in the eyes of most of the pagans, their "partners"
made alluring the slaughter of their children, in order to lead
them to their own destruction, and cause confusion in their
religion. If Allah had willed, they would not have done so: But
leave alone them and their inventions.
---
5.
Sura 6.149 - AL-ANAAM (CATTLE, LIVESTOCK)
Say: "With Allah is the argument that reaches home: if it had
been His will, He could indeed have guided you all."
---
6.
Sura 7.177 - AL-ARAF (THE HEIGHTS)
Evil as an example are people who reject Our signs and wrong
their own souls.
Sura 7.178 - AL-ARAF (THE HEIGHTS)
Whom Allah doth guide,- he is on the right path: whom He rejects
from His guidance,- such are the persons who perish.
Sura 7.179 - AL-ARAF (THE HEIGHTS)
Many are the jinns and men we have made for Hell: They have
hearts wherewith they understand not, eyes wherewith they see
not, and ears wherewith they hear not. They are like cattle,-
nay more misguided: for they are heedless (of warning).
---
7.
Sura 9.051 - AL-TAWBA (REPENTANCE, DISPENSATION)
Say: "Nothing will happen to us except what Allah has decreed
for us: He is our protector": and on Allah let the Believers put
their trust.
---
8.
Sura 10.025 - YUNUS (JONAH)
But Allah doth call to the Home of Peace: He doth guide whom He
pleaseth to a way that is straight.
---
9.
Sura 10.099 - YUNUS (JONAH)
If it had been thy Lord's will, they would all have believed,-
all who are on earth! wilt thou then compel mankind, against
their will, to believe!
Sura 10.100 - YUNUS (JONAH)
No soul can believe, except by the will of Allah, and He will
place doubt (or obscurity) on those who will not understand.
---
10.
Sura 11.034 - HUD (HUD)
"Of no profit will be my counsel to you, much as I desire to
give you (good) counsel, if it be that Allah willeth to leave
you astray: He is your Lord! and to Him will ye return!"
11.
Sura 11.118 - HUD (HUD)
If thy Lord had so willed, He could have made mankind one
people: but they will not cease to dispute.
Sura 11.119 - HUD (HUD)
Except those on whom thy Lord hath bestowed His Mercy: and
for this did He create them: and the Word of thy Lord shall be
fulfilled: "I will fill Hell with jinns and men all together."
---
12.
Sura 13.026 - AL-RAD (THE THUNDER)
Allah doth enlarge, or grant by (strict) measure, the sustenance
(which He giveth) to whomso He pleaseth. (The wordly) rejoice in
the life of this world: But the life of this world is but little
comfort in the Hereafter.
Sura 13.027 - AL-RAD (THE THUNDER)
The Unbelievers say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from
his Lord?" Say: "Truly Allah leaveth, to stray, whom He will;
But He guideth to Himself those who turn to Him in penitence,-"
---
13.
Sura 13.039 - AL-RAD (THE THUNDER)
Allah doth blot out or confirm what He pleaseth: with Him is the
Mother of the Book.
---
14.
Sura 14.004 - IBRAHIM (ABRAHAM)
We sent not a messenger except (to teach) in the language of
his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now
Allah leaves straying those whom He pleases and guides whom He
pleases: and He is Exalted in power, full of Wisdom.
---
15.
Sura 14.027 - IBRAHIM (ABRAHAM)
Allah will establish in strength those who believe, with the
word that stands firm, in this world and in the Hereafter; but
Allah will leave, to stray, those who do wrong: Allah doeth what
He willeth.
---
16.
Sura 16.093 - AN-NAHL (THE BEE)
If Allah so willed, He could make you all one people: But He
leaves straying whom He pleases, and He guides whom He pleases:
but ye shall certainly be called to account for all your
actions.
---
17.
Sura 020.050 - TA-HA (TA-HA)
Y:
He said: "Our Lord is He Who gave to each
(created) thing its form and nature, and further, gave (it)
guidance." P: He said: Our Lord is He Who gave unto everything
its nature, then guided it aright.
---
18.
Sura 32.013 - AS-SAJDA (THE PROSTRATION, WORSHIP, ADORATION)
If We had so willed, We could certainly have brought every soul
its true guidance: but the Word from Me will come true, "I will
fill Hell with jinns and men all together."
---
19.
Sura 35.008 - FATIR (THE ANGELS, ORIGINATOR)
Is he, then, to whom the evil of his conduct is made alluring,
so that he looks upon it as good, (equal to one who is rightly
guided)? For Allah leaves to stray whom He wills, and guides
whom He wills. So let not thy soul go out in (vainly) sighing
after them: for Allah knows well all that they do!
---
20.
Sura 39.023 - AZ-ZUMAR (THE TROOPS, THRONGS)
Allah has revealed (from time to time) the most beautiful
Message in the form of a Book, consistent with itself, (yet)
repeating (its teaching in various aspects): the skins of those
who fear their Lord tremble thereat; then their skins and their
hearts do soften to the celebration of Allah's praises. Such is
the guidance of Allah: He guides therewith whom He pleases, but
such as Allah leaves to stray, can have none to guide.
---
21.
Sura 39.037 - AZ-ZUMAR (THE TROOPS, THRONGS)
And such as Allah doth guide there can be none to lead astray.
Is not Allah Exalted in Power, (Able to enforce His Will), Lord
of Retribution?
---
22.
Sura 42.044 - ASH-SHURA (COUNCIL, CONSULTATION)
For any whom Allah leaves astray, there is no protector
thereafter. And thou wilt see the Wrong-doers, when in sight of
the Penalty, Say: "Is there any way (to effect) a return?"
---
23.
Sura 42.046 - ASH-SHURA (COUNCIL, CONSULTATION)
And no protectors have they to help them, other than Allah. And
for any whom Allah leaves to stray, there is no way (to the
Goal).
---
24.
Sura 57.022 - AL-HADID (THE IRON)
No misfortune can happen on earth or in your souls but is
recorded in a decree before We bring it into existence: That is
truly easy for Allah:
---
25.
Sura 74.031 - AL-MUDDATHTHIR (THE CLOAKED ONE, THE MAN WEARING A
CLOAK)
And We have set none but angels as Guardians of the Fire; and We
have fixed their number only as a trial for Unbelievers,- in
order that the People of the Book may arrive at certainty, and
the Believers may increase in Faith,- and that no doubts may be
left for the People of the Book and the Believers, and that
those in whose hearts is a disease and the Unbelievers may say,
"What symbol doth Allah intend by this?" Thus doth Allah leave
to stray whom He pleaseth, and guide whom He pleaseth: and none
can know the forces of thy Lord, except He and this is no other
than a warning to mankind.
----
26.
Sura 074.054 - AL-MUDDATHTHIR (THE CLOAKED ONE, THE MAN WEARING
A CLOAK)
Nay, this surely is an admonition:
074.055
Let any who will, keep it in remembrance!
074.056
But none will keep it in remembrance except as Allah wills: He
is the Lord of Righteousness, and the Lord of Forgiveness.
---
27.
Sura 76.029 - AL-MULK (THE SOVEREIGNTY, CONTROL)
This is an admonition: Whosoever will, let him take a (straight)
Path to his Lord.
Sura 76.030
But ye will not, except as Allah wills; for Allah is full of
Knowledge and Wisdom.
Sura 76.031
He will admit to His Mercy whom He will; But the
wrong-doers,- for them has He prepared a grievous Penalty.
----
28.
Sura 81.028-9 - AT-TAKWIR (THE OVERTHROWING)
(With profit) to whoever among you wills to go straight:
But ye shall not will except as Allah wills,- the Cherisher of
the Worlds.
---
I am a sovereign citizen of the Multiverse, and I vote!