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United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
#1

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
A group of leaders of the United Methodist Church, the second-largest Protestant denomination in the US,
announced on Friday a plan that would formally split the church, citing "fundamental differences" over same-sex
marriage after years of division.

Under an agreement to be voted on in May, a new “traditionalist Methodist” denomination would
continue to ban same-sex marriage and gay and lesbian clergy
.

—Why is this church even discussing this sort of thing in an enlightened 21st century?  Surely by now one
of the leading Christian denominations in the US should've accepted the reality of same-sex relationships,
and same-sex marriages?

And if you want to see how rabid this "traditionalist" arm of the US Methodist church is in its reprehensible
anti-homosexual platform, read this and be sickened:

Another Big Win for Anti-Gay Coalition.

The anti-gay coalition in the UMC celebrated another big win this week as queer clergy member,
Reverend Anna Blaedel was removed from ministry in Iowa ("for being a self-avowed practicing homosexual
in violation of Paragraphs 2702.1.b and 304.e of the Book of Discipline")...  The reverend Tom Lambrecht
(cited in the first link) is the co-author of a 2004 plan calling for forced departures where he promised,
"tightening the requirements regarding homosexuality" would help those harmed to "leave the denomination".
I'm a creationist;   I believe that man created God.
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#2

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
They're soon to be the "not-so-United Methodist Church."
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#3

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
I’m actually surprised there are any Methodist churches that accept gay marriage or support gay rights.
god, ugh
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#4

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
"There's a Methodist to their Madness."
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#5

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
Schism!  Schism!!

I love it when religitards fight each other.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#6

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
(01-05-2020, 04:17 PM)Minimalist Wrote: Schism!  Schism!!

I love it when religitards fight each other.

Next thing you know, they'll be fighting openly in our streets
and killing each other with prayer books and hassocks.           Big Grin
I'm a creationist;   I believe that man created God.
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#7

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
You say that like its a bad thing!
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#8

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
I was fairly active in a United Methodist church for a few years when I lived in Atlanta. The church was overall fairly progressive, & bible studies there largely lead to my becoming more liberal both politically and religiously. Funnily enough it played a big part in my wife & I finding our way out of religion altogether. They were very supportive of LGBT people from what I saw, & I know they were pushing for support of same-sex marriage within the denomination. After my experience there, I'm not the least bit surprised that it is finally leading to a split in the denomination. While I'd prefer to see people stop believing outright, at least some of them moving to a less repressive version of the belief is a step in the right direction.
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#9

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
I agree.  Baby steps in the right direction far surpass giant leaps backwards!
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#10

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
(01-07-2020, 07:04 PM)isbelldl Wrote: I was fairly active in a United Methodist church for a few years when I lived in Atlanta. The church was overall fairly progressive, & bible studies there largely lead to my becoming more liberal both politically and religiously. Funnily enough it played a big part in my wife & I finding our way out of religion altogether. They were very supportive of LGBT people from what I saw, & I know they were pushing for support of same-sex marriage within the denomination. After my experience there, I'm not the least bit surprised that it is finally leading to a split in the denomination. While I'd prefer to see people stop believing outright, at least some of them moving to a less repressive version of the belief is a step in the right direction.

thank you for your insight from within. Those of us who have never been involved are honestly ignorant of the workings.
It gives me a great deal of hope to see this because it lets believers do the right thing on a subject that is very volatile. Lgbtq rights are under assault and anything that shows some support from what was viewed as a monolithic block of opposition is truly heartening.
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#11

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
(01-07-2020, 07:04 PM)isbelldl Wrote: I was fairly active in a United Methodist church for a few years when I lived in Atlanta. The church was overall fairly progressive, & bible studies there largely lead to my becoming more liberal both politically and religiously. Funnily enough it played a big part in my wife & I finding our way out of religion altogether. They were very supportive of LGBT people from what I saw, & I know they were pushing for support of same-sex marriage within the denomination. After my experience there, I'm not the least bit surprised that it is finally leading to a split in the denomination. While I'd prefer to see people stop believing outright, at least some of them moving to a less repressive version of the belief is a step in the right direction.

My late / prior wife came out of a rural Methodist church. From what I noted, urban Methodists and rural Methodists reflected the national political divide where political liberals tend to be urban and conservatives tend to be rural.

The denomination assigned ministers to congregations, unlike the environment I grew up in, where prospective pastors were "called" by the local church, not the other way around.

Imagine the rural congregation's consternation when the denomination assigned a female pastor to them!

Oh, the angst, and the hand-wringing!

To her credit, she won them over, and became quite beloved, though it took 2 or 3 years of hard work. It helped that the guy she replaced was an asshat. It was an easy act to follow.

On balance I'd say even my late wife's rural Methodist background was a notch or two less conservative than the Bible Churches I grew up in. And by contrast some of the urban Methodists ... well let's just say there was a Methodist congregation down the road from us when we lived in Phoenix that was very much like a Unitarian Universalist vibe, complete with a jazz ensemble providing Sunday service music, and an aggressively inclusive and diverse regarding race and sexual orientation. My wife did not recognize them as in any way similar to the Methodist church that she grew up in. And they scandalized the other local churches, even the relatively liberal Presbyterians who were a few blocks away.

So, lots of diversity there. And probably room for a split really. It was probably brewing for multiple reasons.
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#12

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
I always keep this handy for just such occasions.

[Image: Rdzzu1w.gif]
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#13

United Methodist Church Plan - Same-Sex Marriage Split
(01-05-2020, 01:52 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: They're soon to be the "not-so-United Methodist Church."

In Oz we have"The Uniting Church" ,which is a combination of several protestant denominations.  

"The Uniting Church in Australia is the third largest Christian denomination in Australia, being surpassed in membership by Roman Catholics and Anglicans. It was formed in 1977 as a result of a merger of the Presbyterian, Methodist and Congregational churches. The church has an unusual organizational structure. It is "governed by a series of inter-related councils" within which the national Assembly has "determining responsibility for matters of doctrine, worship, government and discipline."

They follow a form of local option concerning the ordination of gay and lesbian candidates who are in loving, committed relationships. Individual presbytery can automatically reject all such candidates. Other presbyteries can consider the nature of a candidate's relationship as one aspect of their candidacy.
The Uniting Church is not the only mainstream denomination in Australia to have ordained homosexual men and women. But, it may be the first to admit that it is possible. While some homosexual ministers have come out in the past, the decision of "clarification" at the 2003 Assembly, and the negative reaction to what for many was an unpleasant revelation, will not make it easier for openly homosexual candidates for ordination to find welcoming congregations and presbyteries."



In the early 1980's I worked as volunteer Lifeline telephone counsellor. This was (and is, as far as I know)  non directive. The client was given a list of options .The choice was their's  and there was no hidden agenda with"christian values" . Abortion was given as on option in an unwanted pregnancy.  Lifeline was run at that time by The Adelaide  Central Mission (Uniting Church) 


Religions reflect their communities.  America remains  a relatively puritanical society.NO? Have a look at the  sex ed curriculum in US high Schools . Are condoms available in US Public High Schools? --the US still has the highest teen birth rate in the developed world .

There is no evidence that making condoms available to teens increases sexual activity.---And so what if it did, among teens from say 16?   Their sexual mores are already formed by that age. That their parents don't wont their teens to be sexually active is naive and none of their business,. 

 A female friend was allowed at 16, to bring boys  home to stay  overnight  (in her room) Of course, was taught about birth control as appropriate  by age. She continued the tradition with her daughter . The reasoning all the while has been "She will do it anyway. Here she's safe"

Disclaimer: Childless expert here, so will not argue with parents. 
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