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No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
#1

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-0...ww.bbc.com

Quote:A 3.8-million-year-old hominin

cranium from Woranso-Mille, Ethiopia

[Image: dd7f9eb4255f982a4583f9324bb46437.jpg]
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#2

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
The flip side of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's comment is that it doesn't matter if it's true if you don't believe it.
[Image: signature%20The-Ascension-of-Iweko.jpg]
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#3

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-29-2019, 03:06 PM)Dānu Wrote: The flip side of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's comment is that it doesn't matter if it's true if you don't believe it.

If you don't believe venomous snakes can kill you, they still will.


[Image: fa328354c340a17255d3a98e0f454a70-jpg.jpg]

Oh, no Hallucinations 4:11 says the 'gilded sheep should be stewed in rat blood' but Morons 5:16 contradicts it.
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#4

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
Ssshhh, Chas.  Every so often the snakes do a big favor.


https://medium.com/indelible-ink/the-sto...69676ad568

Quote:Pentecostal Snake Handler Refuses Help and Dies
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#5

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-29-2019, 11:45 PM)Chas Wrote:
(08-29-2019, 03:06 PM)Dānu Wrote: The flip side of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's comment is that it doesn't matter if it's true if you don't believe it.

If you don't believe venomous snakes can kill you, they still will.


[Image: fa328354c340a17255d3a98e0f454a70-jpg.jpg]

QED.
[Image: signature%20The-Ascension-of-Iweko.jpg]
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#6

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-29-2019, 11:45 PM)Chas Wrote:
(08-29-2019, 03:06 PM)Dānu Wrote: The flip side of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's comment is that it doesn't matter if it's true if you don't believe it.

If you don't believe venomous snakes can kill you, they still will.


[Image: fa328354c340a17255d3a98e0f454a70-jpg.jpg]

Ah Jeez, is that bunch of inbred hillbillies still around?. The snake handling belief   comes from an obscure text in the  Book of  Mark, mainly . A goodly number have actually died after being bitten by one or more of their snakes.. Obviously not nearly enough.  Sadly, some seem to build up an immunity.

Wasn't overly  surprised to learn that it's a few members of some of the happy clappy churches who also like to handle snakes.  Not much of a stretch  from speaking in tongues to snake handling, surely.

The Wiki article linked below is fascinating;  


"And these signs shall follow them that believe: In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues. They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mark 16:17-18)

Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (Luke 10:19) "

Interesting passages, they have an ancient  Egyptian 'flavour'  to me.  .The Egyptians were dotty about snakes. Indeed most major world cultures have some kind of deep  belief/mythology about snakes.--Start with the Garden of Eden . Many other cultures equate the serpent with wisdom , or at least positively .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_hand...n_religion
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#7

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-30-2019, 04:50 AM)grympy Wrote: They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them;

Their ceremonies seem to be big on snake handling, but not so much on quaffing deadly drinks.   Consider
No gods necessary
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#8

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
Quote:The snake handling belief   comes from an obscure text in the  Book of  Mark, mainly .


Which was a late addition to it because the early xtian shitiwits decided that the original ending sucked.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#9

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-30-2019, 04:50 AM)grympy Wrote:
(08-29-2019, 11:45 PM)Chas Wrote:
(08-29-2019, 03:06 PM)Dānu Wrote: The flip side of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's comment is that it doesn't matter if it's true if you don't believe it.

If you don't believe venomous snakes can kill you, they still will.


[Image: fa328354c340a17255d3a98e0f454a70-jpg.jpg]

Ah Jeez, is that bunch of inbred hillbillies still around?. The snake handling belief   comes from an obscure text in the  Book of  Mark, mainly . A goodly number have actually died after being bitten by one or more of their snakes.. Obviously not nearly enough.  Sadly, some seem to build up an immunity.

Wasn't overly  surprised to learn that it's a few members of some of the happy clappy churches who also like to handle snakes.  Not much of a stretch  from speaking in tongues to snake handling, surely.

The Wiki article linked below is fascinating;  


"And these signs shall follow them that believe: In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues. They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mark 16:17-18)

Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (Luke 10:19) "

Interesting passages, they have an ancient  Egyptian 'flavour'  to me.  .The Egyptians were dotty about snakes. Indeed most major world cultures have some kind of deep  belief/mythology about snakes.--Start with the Garden of Eden . Many other cultures equate the serpent with wisdom , or at least positively .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_hand...n_religion

The passage in question -- indeed, the last half of the last "chapter" of Mark -- is widely regarded as a "pious fraud" even by most fundamentalists. It was in other words a later addition to the manuscript.

That's the irony ... they've based a whole practice around a fragment of scripture that isn't even a legitimate, accepted part of Holy Writ.
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#10

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
So as I read the article, they were tossing ad hominins at each other a few million years ago.
Right ?
You "Astralopithecus" ... you.
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#11

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-29-2019, 11:45 PM)Chas Wrote:
(08-29-2019, 03:06 PM)Dānu Wrote: The flip side of Neil DeGrasse Tyson's comment is that it doesn't matter if it's true if you don't believe it.

If you don't believe venomous snakes can kill you, they still will.


[Image: fa328354c340a17255d3a98e0f454a70-jpg.jpg]

Some of my cousins are snake handlers. We lose a few each year. Having anti-venom available shows a lack of faith. So does being within an hour's drive of a hospital.
  [Image: pirates.gif] Dog  
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#12

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
No worry there.  Rural hospitals are closing like mad.

https://www.modernhealthcare.com/article...of-closure

Quote:Nearly a quarter of rural hospitals are on the brink of closure

Prayer may be all they have left.

Or, they could leave the snakes alone.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#13

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(09-03-2019, 06:36 PM)mordant Wrote:
(08-30-2019, 04:50 AM)grympy Wrote:
(08-29-2019, 11:45 PM)Chas Wrote: If you don't believe venomous snakes can kill you, they still will.


[Image: fa328354c340a17255d3a98e0f454a70-jpg.jpg]

Ah Jeez, is that bunch of inbred hillbillies still around?. The snake handling belief   comes from an obscure text in the  Book of  Mark, mainly . A goodly number have actually died after being bitten by one or more of their snakes.. Obviously not nearly enough.  Sadly, some seem to build up an immunity.

Wasn't overly  surprised to learn that it's a few members of some of the happy clappy churches who also like to handle snakes.  Not much of a stretch  from speaking in tongues to snake handling, surely.

The Wiki article linked below is fascinating;  


"And these signs shall follow them that believe: In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues. They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. (Mark 16:17-18)

Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (Luke 10:19) "

Interesting passages, they have an ancient  Egyptian 'flavour'  to me.  .The Egyptians were dotty about snakes. Indeed most major world cultures have some kind of deep  belief/mythology about snakes.--Start with the Garden of Eden . Many other cultures equate the serpent with wisdom , or at least positively .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_hand...n_religion

The passage in question -- indeed, the last half of the last "chapter" of Mark -- is widely regarded as a "pious fraud" even by most fundamentalists. It was in other words a later addition to the manuscript.

That's the irony ... they've based a whole practice around a fragment of scripture that isn't even a legitimate, accepted part of Holy Writ.
 
Gee ,and what were the chances of that?*   Consider


What are your  thoughts on the veracity of the Epistles of St Paul? 

*my reference: "Misquoting Jesus' Bart Ehrman
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#14

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(08-30-2019, 05:01 AM)brunumb Wrote:
(08-30-2019, 04:50 AM)grympy Wrote: They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them;

Their ceremonies seem to be big on snake handling, but not so much on quaffing deadly drinks.   Consider

Yeah, be interesting to see the outcome of them drinking say  a pint of chlorine bleach or possibly some rat poison. Tongue
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#15

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
I'd pay to watch!
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#16

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(09-03-2019, 10:53 PM)grympy Wrote: What are your  thoughts on the veracity of the Epistles of St Paul? 

I'm not sure what you mean by "veracity". I think Paul probably didn't author half the stuff attributed to him; even literalists doubt that he wrote Hebrews for example, and most scholars doubt the Pauline authorship of Ephesians, Titus, and I and II Timothy.

I think that, understood as written well before even the most charitable dating of the gospels, his writing isn't remotely on the same page as the gospels; his writings tend to be interpreted with the presupposition that the gospel events were common knowledge in Paul's day. It is my belief that most gospel events are totally made up, and never happened. Regardless of whether one is a mythicist or a historicist / traditionalist concerning the existence of Jesus himself, and his role in founding Christianity, Paul was pushing an almost gnostic spiritualized belief system that modern believers have to pretty much twist into a pretzel to fit modern theology or with Jesus' alleged teachings, or even with Jesus' existence. There is even a small group of Christians who see enough divergence in Paul's teaching from the rest of the NT that their response to it is to accept only Paul's corpus as inspired.
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#17

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
"For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.
And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time."
1 Corinthians 15 : 3-8

First of all, elsewhere Paul says he got his gospel from no man. He got it from his hallucination.
When he supposedly wrote that, there were no "scriptures'' saying anything about anything.
If "seeing" means anything, it does not mean "seeing a live risen re-animated corpse".
It *has* to mean "coming to understand differently". Paul never saw Jesus.
The "dying for sins" had not developed yet, as it was not the role of a messiah to do that.
It was invented when the end-times did not happen.

Another really important fact that seems to get over-looked about all this, because we are so culturally accustomed to hearing the tales ... so we don't even notice ...
is the fact that Jewish apocalyptic heroes don't get re-animated ... they don't "rise from the dead". It's not a concept that has a home in Judaism. There were cultures of the time that had dying and rising gods ... many of them did. Judaism did not. The subject of the Jewish apocalyptic hero is interesting. The 7 sons of Hannah in Maccabees each gave their apocalyptic martyr speech and were martyred ... and they were "exalted" for their heroic actions, but their "exaltation" did not involve rising from the dead or being seated by Yahweh as a "son" in the sense that Christians eventually claimed their hero had the son-ship of exaltation. There is not one example of a Jewish hero that rises from the dead. They do get "exalted status", but it does not mean divinity equivalent to Yahweh's divinity or unique "son-ship" or physically re-animated. My opinion is that Ehrman could have been a lot more clear about these things in his book about "exaltation", ("How Jesus Became a God").
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#18

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
https://depts.drew.edu/jhc/rp1cor15.html

Quote:William O. Walker Jr., has suggested that, contrary to those opinions just reviewed, "in dealing with any particular letter in the corpus, the burden of proof rests with any argument that the corpus or, indeed any particular letter within the corpus... contains no interpolations."[size=undefined]4[/size] Among the reasons advanced by Walker is the fact that:


the surviving text of the Pauline letters is the text promoted by the historical winners in the theological and ecclesiastical struggles of the second and third centuries... In short, it appears likely that the emerging Catholic leadership in the churches 'standardized' the text of the Pauline corpus in the light of 'orthodox' views and practices, suppressing and even destroying all deviant texts and manuscripts. Thus it is that we have no manuscripts dating from earlier than the third century; thus it is that all of the extant manuscripts are remarkably similar in most of their significant features; and thus it is that the manuscript evidence can tell us nothing about the state of the Pauline literature prior to the third century.[size=undefined]5[/size]


Now the jesus freaks will have a shit hemorrhage because Price wrote this but he quotes William O. Walker, who is:

Quote:William O. Walker Jr.
Jennie Farris Railey King Professor Emeritus of Religion
Trinity University, San Antonio, Texas
William O. Walker, Jr., is Jennie Farris Railey King Professor Emeritus of Religion at Trinity University in San Antonio, Texas, where he served as a member of the faculty and as an administrator from 1962 until his retirement in 2002.

you know, what Free calls "not a real scholar!"
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#19

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(09-06-2019, 12:51 AM)mordant Wrote:
(09-03-2019, 10:53 PM)grympy Wrote: What are your  thoughts on the veracity of the Epistles of St Paul? 

I'm not sure what you mean by "veracity". I think Paul probably didn't author half the stuff attributed to him; even literalists doubt that he wrote Hebrews for example, and most scholars doubt the Pauline authorship of Ephesians, Titus, and I and II Timothy.

I think that, understood as written well before even the most charitable dating of the gospels, his writing isn't remotely on the same page as the gospels; his writings tend to be interpreted with the presupposition that the gospel events were common knowledge in Paul's day. It is my belief that most gospel events are totally made up, and never happened. Regardless of whether one is a mythicist or a historicist / traditionalist concerning the existence of Jesus himself, and his role in founding Christianity, Paul was pushing an almost gnostic spiritualized belief system that modern believers have to pretty much twist into a pretzel to fit modern theology or with Jesus' alleged teachings, or even with Jesus' existence. There is even a small group of Christians who see enough divergence in Paul's teaching from the rest of the NT that their response to it is to accept only Paul's corpus as inspired.

I meant 'veracity' in the sense of ' real' or 'truthful' . We think much the same , except you seem to be much more knowledgeable than I.
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#20

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(09-03-2019, 09:35 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Some of my cousins are snake handlers...

I have a small One-Eyed Trouser snake, which I handle more than regularly on a daily basis,
but at the same time, very gently. It's never caused me any issues, and is certainly not venomous,
although sometimes it's reluctant to perform on command, particularly in public.

[Image: caecillian.jpg]
I'm a creationist;   I believe that man created God.
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#21

No Adam. No Eve. Bad Day For Fairy Tales!
(09-06-2019, 01:52 PM)SYZ Wrote:
(09-03-2019, 09:35 PM)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Some of my cousins are snake handlers...

I have a small One-Eyed Trouser snake, which I handle more than regularly on a daily basis,
but at the same time, very gently. It's never caused me any issues, and is certainly not venomous,
although sometimes it's reluctant to perform on command, particularly in public.

[Image: caecillian.jpg]

Is that  gangrene or just high blood pressure?

What is it really?  Consider
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