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Poll: The Nature of People?
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Most people are good with a few jerks
25.00%
6 25.00%
Most people are jerks with a few good people in the mix
25.00%
6 25.00%
I want a brownie Wink
50.00%
12 50.00%
Total 24 vote(s) 100%
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Poll: The Nature of People
#26

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-10-2019, 11:25 PM)GenesisNemesis Wrote:
(06-10-2019, 11:23 PM)Alan V Wrote: So yes, you see the question is about people being intentional jerks.  I considered the question more about how we humans are naturally, because of our limitations -- which we all might wish to escape if we could.  A certain amount of critical self-awareness can be generalized, because people aren't all that different.

You could say most people are incompetent with dealing with the reality of climate change for example, I suppose.  Tongue

This discussion has an interesting bearing on historical mistakes.  With our advantaged perspective from the present, it seems to us that many such historical mistakes should have been easily avoidable.  But perhaps we are ourselves making huge mistakes (like changing the climate) for the same reason -- because of our limited human nature.  

So does our human nature make us naturally opportunistic?  My answer is still "Yes," and I don't think that's being arrogant because I include myself.  The one important qualification is what Dancefortwo mentioned above.  We are inconsistent at best.
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#27

Poll: The Nature of People
I just want my brownie please.  Big Grin


Neither. I mean some people think i'm bitter while others say i'm sweet. Perhaps i'm bittersweet.  Tongue

Not much different than my experience with people. Who can be jerks in one situation while being kind hearted in a totally different scenario. People may appear sweet on the surface but what happens when things are going completely astray in their life? When there is a lot of drama going on? Some people change instantly without even realizing it.
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#28

Poll: The Nature of People
I rarely eat chocolate, but that's for what I voted.

Anywho, this reminds me of that asinine questions on the employer sociological assessment:

Most people are honest by nature - I want to be completely honest and state strongly disagree, but I don't.
Most people can be trusted - I want to be completely honest and state strongly disagree, but I don't.
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#29

Poll: The Nature of People
[Image: 51994081f9b92dca686f91113253fec7.jpg]
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#30

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 04:18 AM)Phaedrus Wrote: I rarely eat chocolate, but that's for what I voted.

Anywho, this reminds me of that asinine questions on the employer sociological assessment:

Most people are honest by nature - I want to be completely honest and state strongly disagree, but I don't.
Most people can be trusted - I want to be completely honest and state strongly disagree, but I don't.

That’s why there’s a brownie option  Tongue
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#31

Poll: The Nature of People
Where is the "absolutely everybody is 100% selfish", option?

Well, under my own view intentions ultimately aren't what matters from a moral standpoint. So that's why I've chosen the "most people are jerks" option. The few good people are the few people (VERY few people) who don't act shitty, regardless of their selfish intentions.

Now, the question is whether such very rare nice people would be non-shitty in all circumstances? I highly doubt it because even the nice people are only nice when it suits them.
My Argument Against Free Will Wrote:(1) Ultimately, to control your actions you have to originate your original nature.

(2) But you can't originate your original nature—it's already there.

(3) So, ultimately, you can't control your actions.
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#32

Poll: The Nature of People
My very personal opinion—plus my observations of people over sixty years—is that most are good people with a
few jerks thrown into the mix.  And I certainly don't believe any people start out as jerks, other than the minority
of initially naive and/or gullible types who're easily led astray and end up as jerks.

Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.  (But I guess that's another topic altogether.)

—Uh... can I still have my Brownie?     Tongue
I'm a creationist;   I believe that man created God.
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#33

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 02:29 PM)SYZ Wrote: My very personal opinion—plus my observations of people over sixty years—is that most are good people with a
few jerks thrown into the mix.  And I certainly don't believe any people start out as jerks, other than the minority
of initially naive and/or gullible types who're easily led astray and end up as jerks.

Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.  (But I guess that's another topic altogether.)

—Uh... can I still have my Brownie?     Tongue

Ha ha, yes  Big Grin
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#34

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 02:29 PM)SYZ Wrote: Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some 
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.

Why does every discussion have to be about Donald Trump?   hobo
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#35

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 03:08 PM)Alan V Wrote:
(06-11-2019, 02:29 PM)SYZ Wrote: Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some 
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.

Why does every discussion have to be about Donald Trump?   hobo

I'd suggest god, but we already talk about him too much as it is.
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#36

Poll: The Nature of People
The difference between god and the Orange Shitgibbon is that the Orange Shitgibbon actually exists.

Both are thoroughly disgusting tyrants.
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#37

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 02:29 PM)SYZ Wrote: My very personal opinion—plus my observations of people over sixty years—is that most are good people with a
few jerks thrown into the mix.  And I certainly don't believe any people start out as jerks, other than the minority
of initially naive and/or gullible types who're easily led astray and end up as jerks.

Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.  (But I guess that's another topic altogether.)

—Uh... can I still have my Brownie?     Tongue

I'd give you some of mine, but it'd be hard as a rock by the time you got it.

Now I want a brownie, but can't have one because I can't drive after my foot surgery.  Undecided
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#38

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 04:58 PM)Fireball Wrote:
(06-11-2019, 02:29 PM)SYZ Wrote: My very personal opinion—plus my observations of people over sixty years—is that most are good people with a
few jerks thrown into the mix.  And I certainly don't believe any people start out as jerks, other than the minority
of initially naive and/or gullible types who're easily led astray and end up as jerks.

Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.  (But I guess that's another topic altogether.)

—Uh... can I still have my Brownie?     Tongue

I'd give you some of mine, but it'd be hard as a rock by the time you got it.

Now I want a brownie, but can't have one because I can't drive after my foot surgery.  Undecided

Awww *hugs*
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#39

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 03:08 PM)Alan V Wrote:
(06-11-2019, 02:29 PM)SYZ Wrote: Although, having said that, I do believe an extremely tiny minority of people are actually born evil—due to some 
sort of genetic neurological dysfunctionality of their brains.

Why does every discussion have to be about Donald Trump?   hobo

Well, Trump was abused as a child, as far as I know. Not saying we should necessarily have sympathy for him because of that, but it's a factor to take into consideration, with regards to why he is the way he is. And there is a systemic problem where men are told to act tough or else they're "weak". Even I was subject to that concept as a child thanks to my father.
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#40

Poll: The Nature of People
How do you know that the chump was abused as a child?
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#41

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 07:26 PM)Fireball Wrote: How do you know that the chump was abused as a child?

I just checked and turns out there was no evidence for that, so nevermind. Guess I misremembered something I thought I read. But the other point is still true, and pretty sure his father had some fucked up views as well. For example he believed the family had "superior genes".
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#42

Poll: The Nature of People
I roll with Solzhenitsyn: "The line between good and evil runs down the middle of every heart."

There are certainly people who consistently choose one side or the other of that line, but I think most folks I've encountered don't really think that much about it at all, and veer from one to the other based on immediate needs.
<Insert intelligent thought here>
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#43

Poll: The Nature of People
Frankly I'd prefer to think he was abused and that people don't just roll that way for kicks.

From what I've heard, his relationship with his father was pretty bad. Not that it justifies anything he has done.
"Talk nonsense, but talk your own nonsense, and I'll kiss you for it. To go wrong in one's own way is better than to go right in someone else's. 
F. D.
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#44

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 07:56 PM)Mark Wrote: Frankly I'd prefer to think he was abused and that people don't just roll that way for kicks.

From what I've heard, his relationship with his father was pretty bad.  Not that it justifies anything he has done.

It seems like a pretty reasonable assumption that bigoted/racist people are fucked up in many different ways other than their bigotry/racism.
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#45

Poll: The Nature of People
I re-did my voted and voted Brownie.  I feel better now.
                                                         T4618
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#46

Poll: The Nature of People
For a long time, I felt that my atheism was a salubrious antidote to the deeply pessimistic view of my past evangelical handlers, that humans are basically unworthy, corrupt pieces of shit who would pillage, rape and burn apart from the restraining / "leavening" influence of believers.

I came to the view, gradually, that most people, given half a chance, mean well and try their best to do well. Warts and all.

But then Trumpism came along and all the progress you could kid yourself that we've made on fronts like racism, equality, and addressing climate change, was actually just that we had suppressed the true feelings and expressions of an awful lot of asshats who are now gleefully expressing themselves like it's 1950 again.

I still hold the view that there is much goodness in people and the world, bad as it is, is way less bad than it was 100, 500, or 1000 years ago.

But I'm no longer nearly so confident about it.
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#47

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 08:54 PM)Dancefortwo Wrote: I re-did my voted and voted Brownie.  I feel better now.

I sometimes wish this was an irl thing where every week someone brings goodies for our get-togethers  Big Grin
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#48

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 09:06 PM)mordant Wrote: For a long time, I felt that my atheism was a salubrious antidote to the deeply pessimistic view of my past evangelical handlers, that humans are basically unworthy, corrupt pieces of shit who would pillage, rape and burn apart from the restraining / "leavening" influence of believers.

I came to the view, gradually, that most people, given half a chance, mean well and try their best to do well. Warts and all.

But then Trumpism came along and all the progress you could kid yourself that we've made on fronts like racism, equality, and addressing climate change, was actually just that we had suppressed the true feelings and expressions of an awful lot of asshats who are now gleefully expressing themselves like it's 1950 again.

I still hold the view that there is much goodness in people and the world, bad as it is, is way less bad than it was 100, 500, or 1000 years ago.

But I'm no longer nearly so confident about it.

Yes, they are legion. But they represent a minority of the US population. A large minority, but they can be made to crawl back under their rocks with decent leadership.
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#49

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 07:26 PM)Fireball Wrote: How do you know that the chump was abused as a child?

If that little scumbag was my kid I'd have beaten the shit out of him too.  Someone should have done a better job of it!
Robert G. Ingersoll : “No man with a sense of humor ever founded a religion.”
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#50

Poll: The Nature of People
(06-11-2019, 11:05 PM)Minimalist Wrote:
(06-11-2019, 07:26 PM)Fireball Wrote: How do you know that the chump was abused as a child?

If that little scumbag was my kid I'd have beaten the shit out of him too.  Someone should have done a better job of it!

Now, what would you have done with an empty bag of skin after said exercise?  ROFL2  I kill me!
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